Q1. Cass: How did you become a Hollywood stuntman and what’s your own advice to anyone who is serious about becoming a stuntman?

Dave: I got my first call while working on the original Batman movie starring Michael Keaton. I was playing a role in the movie. (I was one of the bikers. They had me driving up and down the Gotham city street as part of the atmosphere). While the rest of the people who were working as extras were sitting around on night-shoots discussing their life stories in a tent, I was out on the set practicing my kicks and moves. Turned out a good friend of mine who was an actor in the movie heard that they needed a fighter to do some intricate fights. My friend recommended me to the Producer and I got the call to audition. I had never done a stunt punch or kick till I put on the Bat costume! I only knew contact fighting! And so the journey to don’t hit for real was the strangest skill I had to learn.

For anyone out there pursuing the stunt world - get as many skills as you can. Learn to act, be extremely focused and pay attention. Respect the fear before doing a stunt and also never be candid or casual with any stunt! No matter how simple it may seem.

Q2. Cass: Ever been injured and hurt doing stunts and what would be the worst experience of injury doing the job you do?

Dave: I have been very lucky to be honest. I got a cracked floating rib while being kicked out of a moving car in the movie Nothing To Lose. I did about seven takes while sucking up the pain. Only on Cut, did I finally let the pain take over! And off to hospital I went. The scariest stunt for me was being hit by a Trans-Am car in the Madonna video, What it feels like for a girl. A good car hit is unpredictable. Guy Ritchie said to me before the take, ‘Dave, I don’t want to see a typical stunt hit where you go up in the air and roll out of it!’ I told him, ‘Guy, you get one take! And this one is for you.’ And so, I simply became a passenger in the air. That car hit put me on my back for three days. No matter how much padding I used, every bone in my body hurt.

Q3. Cass: What’s your favourite type of stunt choreography and what is the most dangerous and difficult stunt you have to do in a movie?

Dave: Choreography to me has three elements. First is the entrance (where it starts), then in the middle it can seem to continue in the same direction and yet looses itself, and the third element (if you have the right people/talent to work with), it goes ballistic and unpredictable. This applies whether it’s a fight, a car chase or even a high fall where the faller bounces off a few walls on the way down. I got a very rare chance to see that in the Cass movie regarding the fights. In fact the raw talent I had to work with had talent in a different way than that of trained stunt fighters. As a choreographer, the fights are drawn from the script/story and the actor’s ability. It’s so much more rewarding when a fight loses the choreography and anarchy takes over which is exposed in the Cass movie.

The most dangerous stunt for me was in The Prophecy 3 movie with Christopher Walken and Jennifer Beals. I played one of the very bad angels, Hagil. I did a roof-to-roof jump while being chased. It was about 150ft jump across and about 100ft down. All good, except there was no air bag below or boxes! It was a wide shot and all I had was a skinny little cable attached to my chest harness that was wired to a huge crane above. When I ran to the edge of the building I couldn’t risk hesitating as the cables were in motion and I had to completely commit. On one take the cables slowed down and I was hanging right in the middle of the two rooftops with this very small cable giving me my life! I am sure the Director was bustin’ my balls then because they broke for lunch (being it was around 3am on a night shoot) and left me hanging.

Q4. Cass: Best actor and also actress you’ve worked with for doing their own stunts giving that they all like to say they do their own stunts anyway?

Dave: I have to say Will Smith in Wild Wild West for doing a lot of his own stunts. While in the belly of the big mechanical spider (at the end of the movie) we are a group of four renegade misfits and take him on in the big fight. Day in and day out he was on the wires getting slammed around while his stunt double sat back watching. The actress would be Ashley Judd (Kiss the girls) for the huge fight in the kitchen scene, getting slammed against walls and hitting the marble floor. Ashley trained real hard to do her own action and was very determined in all her scenes and again, her stunt double sat back watching.

Q5. Cass: When you’re not working what does an action man like you do with your spare time?

Dave: I save the weekends to call family and friends in the UK which I really like. I enjoy teaching my stunt class and dance class. Weekends I go to a Salsa club and get lost on the dance floor for a few hours with the lady. I like to cook, be it Italian or Chinese, when I have guests. I also love to write and read poetry, digest a few good scripts, and watch the biography and geographical channel either on famous peoples’ lives or survival in far off countries.

Q6. Cass: Top three stuntmen you rate and why? Also your all-time favourite three movie stunts you rate high personally.

Dave: For the stuntmen I have to give you four.

Bobby Brown - high fall specialist. He jumps from over a 100ft and perfected his craft, and each time risks his life as a true stunt pro.

Henry Kingi - top driver. His precision in driving (building-to-building jump) can be seen in Lethal Weapon 4.

Vic Armstrong - 2nd unit director. His knowledge and creativity (Bond films) is remarkable.

Dar Robinson (deceased) - he was an all-round stuntman and set the standards.

In no order my three favourite movie stunts are:

Ronin (the driving sequences) starring Robert De Niro.

Swordfish (360 degree camera explosions. Stunt guys were flying everywhere, including me, as the Hummers came crashing in the bank).

Heat (numerous stunts, great action) starring De Niro and Val Kilmer.

Q7. Cass: In being the stunt coordinator on the movie, CASS, what was the brief, challenge and experience like working on the set of this particular movie?

Dave: I could write a book on this one alone! The Cass movie has to be one of the most challenging, learning, and emotional rollercoaster films I have ever worked on while also being so very rewarding. If you have seen the movie 300 the actors had months of pre training with huge battle scenes of well rehearsed fight scenes. But with the Cass film, every action scene was a whole new challenge. After the first rehearsals at the Peacock gym I prayed each day going to work. God! Help me through each day. For example - coaches pull up at the location and out piles over 100 of the most wonderful motley crew type guys you ever saw from up north who have been enjoying the trip to East London since the early hours, and I have to put together a huge Braveheart type battle with only a couple of hours before the camera rolls! Then I have to prepare the very next day an even bigger fight with hundreds of bottles, ashtrays and beer glasses to be used in a Working Men’s club jammed full of your everyday guys, and the Director insisted all the bottles and stuff had to be used! The Batman Returns fight had six cameras, ten stunt clowns, me as Batman, and about twenty-five moves. At the time it was a challenge. But the Cass movie really set me a challenge!

In hindsight I have to be very honest. There were guys who stepped up to the plate for me and were willing to get stuck in and take a serious bruising in unchartered areas. If I may say at this time, I have so much respect for all the performers and they know who they are, and also the actors of the film for trusting me with their physical being. Whenever I go on camera to do a fight, I get a real rush of adrenalin just before the camera rolls. The strangest thing is I still got it as I watched all the performers doing take after take and giving everything they had in the fights. One guy came up to me two days after his fight, pulled up his shirt, and with a big smile said, ‘Dave, take a look at my medals of honour.’ He had bruises with colours all over his back and front - more than I have ever seen! I said, ‘Well Gary, you will be on camera and your fight (more like a beating) is something you can be proud of.’ And off he went as humble as can be. Know this, he had protective pads on front and back, yet the kicking he took and how many times he took it was astonishing. You’ll see it in the movie. Each and every fight in this movie has a starting point as I’ve explained before. As for what happened next - it was pure anarchy. I give the greatest respect to all the performers.

I should say, Cass, it was somewhat of an unorthodox method of training compared to Hollywood. These guys had plenty training of a different kind. Instead of releasing the greyhound to chase the hare, it was like unleashing loads of hungry bulldogs on each other. Again, as I said earlier, I use three elements in choreography, but that changed slightly for your movie. I had the foundation of the fights from you, the trust of the Director Jon Baird, and the full day to day support of the Producer Stefan Haller. I had the whole crew helping me from wardrobe, props and the DP Chris who got stuck inside the action with his camera. I have to say this, Cass, that after every take, you could see all the performers laughing, hugging, shaking hands and quite a few would look at me and say, ‘Hey Dave, how did it look?’ And I’d say, ‘Great, but go in harder! Take the beating. You’ll be on camera and you will be proud of yourselves.’ The guys in every battle gave their utmost each time the camera rolled, and to me, I was so proud of these guys and thank them all for their effort, trust and most of all respect. It was very much a huge team effort. (Almost did write a book).

Q8. Cass: You were also cast in CASS, and such is your name and respect in the dangerous, daring, skilful world of the all action stuntman, it maybe gets overlooked that you are also an actor too.

Dave: I started my acting really playing myself in a BBC1 drama called Salt on a Snake’s Tail. I played the role of a teacher at school that had some Asian kids who were getting bullied after school. It so happened that I was also a martial art teacher and taught them self defence. I then went on to play Gaz in Eastenders back in the Dagmar days with Dirty Den and Angie. Arriving in America, I took acting more seriously. Here is LA everyone is an actor, even the bathroom attendant! So I decided to focus on the big movies and go for the smaller action roles rather than get caught up in the B straight to video type. I sent my acting reel to the Director of Cass and up came Bingo! I was so excited that he created the role for me as I love to work on both sides of the camera, multi tasking they call it. One thing out here, when I go for an audition there will be about 30 yanks all clean cut reading for the part. Keep in mind my London accent was very strong when I first came here (a little like yours Cass!). I studied the American lingo from east coast, west coast and down y’all south. So instead of using the American accent, I go in and do the London/British accent, and the casting people liked the ‘flavour’. Whenever I do a part I usually look in my past for some interesting people I know and play that person - mostly the bad guy roles.

Q9. Cass: It seems that an awful lot of successful stuntmen on the weapons and fighting side have a Martial Arts background and in the UK you are still known for that skill, so can you tell us your Martial Arts background?

Dave: I took up the noble art of Martial Arts when I was around 15 years old, learning as a much as I could wherever I could and practising wherever I could. Not content with the diluted Kung-Fu styles in the UK I jumped on a plane and flew to Malaysia and studied there for a few years and continued travelling around the world learning from the best I could find. Being that the Kung-Fu craze came in the 70’s with the explosion of Bruce Lee, most people were focused on the Black Belt and one style (much respect to them). I preferred to go and learn as many various styles as I could hence my travels worldwide to learn. And for the most part when I would be criticized by other martial artists around that time it was because teaching at my schools never really focused on any one style. ‘What’s your style?’ they’d say. ‘Enter the Dragon or mixed martial arts today?’ But it’s given me a wider range of choices when working in movies. As one guy said to me on the set of Cass while preparing the West Ham/Wolves fight. ‘Dave, where did you learn to do football fighting?’ I thought what an interesting question. I said, ‘I got two answers for you mate. First, either I had to have been there, or second, I’m an effin genius.’

Meaning you can’t learn to football fight. He walked away scratching his head looking a little dumbfounded. So my years of learning Martial Arts all came to a halt on the Cass movie! And yet the years of travelling and learning have taught me more than I could have ever imagined as in styles or cultures and people. My choice to learn Martial Arts prepared me for today.

Q10. Cass: Got a personal bodyguard story you’re able to share with us?

Dave: For the record! Well Cass, this is going to truthfully be my all time favourite. Sure I can go into the exciting travels of the Sam Fox days and the behind the scenes stuff, but let me go to a wine bar in Tottenham back in the mid 80’s. I was called by Sam to escort her to a wine bar she had her name attached to. On arriving at the bar it was bustling with people so Sam and I and her Mother, Carol, were ushered to a table. After Sam did the press shots and signed a few photos we started to make our way to the Ladies as Sam needed to relieve herself. (Why not?). I had Sam in front of me as usual and I led her through the throngs of mostly guys and I reached the staircase leading up to the rest rooms keeping Sam right in front of me. She had a kind of tunnel vision but my eyes were scanning the crowds ahead and I could see an over ambitious guy with two or three of his friends doing the ‘nudge you go, no you go’ stuff. So at the bottom of the stairs I set Sam on her way up with her mother to the rest rooms. Now I had this guy in my face. ‘Oi! Are you her manager or what?’ ‘Nah mate,’ I said. ‘What, the boyfriend?’ ‘Nah mate,’ I repeated. ‘Oh you must be the fucking minder then and you don’t look all that good to me.’ ‘Just as well I’m not the minder then ain’t it!’ And then I ignored him (so he thinks). Knowing he had three of his lads with him who were just itching to get a little attention, when Sam came down the stairs I put her in front of me with my hands on her hips and started to lead her to the front door. I steered her close to the guy and as I passed him I got real close to his face using the crowds as a reason. I said to him, ‘Hey pal...I lied to you... I am!’ He said, ‘You are what?’ I said, ‘One of those three!’ And kept walking. The art of minding is when you’re not minding.

Hey Cass, please allow me here to share with the readers the real story of that night. You can take it out if you want but I have been waiting for this chance for a while. On my trips back and forth to London I started buying books on peoples’ life stories, you know, the gangster type. I had a producer in LA who was thinking of doing a London based 70s/80s movie. So I buy a bunch of books in London and read them back in LA. I returned to London to shoot a movie a few years later. While on the set I was walking around in between shots and saw a guy who looked familiar! I went to one of the actors and asked, ‘Is that guy over there Cass Pennant?’ He said, ‘Yes, why?’ I said. ‘I read a book on him and really loved it.’ So I went over to the table and introduced myself. ‘Hi, my name is Dave Lea, I read your book, it’s a pleasure to meet you and good luck with all you do.’ We exchanged a few words and went our way. I was so excited to have met this guy Cass because his book was so riveting from start to finish. And to be honest at one part of the book I had to put it down! It was that powerful. A short while later you came up to me, Cass, and said, ‘You are Dave Lea.’ You told me, you didn’t ask. Then you went on to tell me the story of the night at the wine bar, and that you were over looking the Fox lady. (Sorry everyone, I’m dragging this out but I have to). The next day, you brought a book into me and said to read a certain page. I did. And there I was being written about by yourself. The book was ‘Bouncers’. When I read that part I thought to myself, this guy writes such respectful things about me and we never knew each other and never would have met if I did not buy his book ‘Cass’ or had taken this movie. It was one of the classiest things I have ever known someone to do. This is a brief summary of how I met you Cass. Now knowing that you were over watching the wine bar which I didn’t know on the night, my ass was covered if the few idiots wanted to be bigger idiots! If anyone wants to know the full story on that night, harass Cass for a copy of the book.

Cass, thank you for your friendship, and most of all, trusting me with your own life story. It was an honour of great magnitude that I will never forget and I am proud to have your movie on my resume. You gave me a lot of respect in that book, Cass, and you did not know me or me you on a personal level. Football teams aside, I met quite a few of the I-C-F past and present, Jasper and his people, and the Wolves guys, also Big Joe Egan, so many to name, I did not get a chance to feel imported from the USA. They were all magnificent to me and I keep in touch with as many as possible. And to think that back then all these football fantatics were...??? Well, let the Cass movie speak for itself.

Q11. Cass: Finally I know personally you are a big Gooner’s fan and we have a bit of banter going on between us with my team being the first team to beat you at the new Highbury. But a season of no silverware, not even a Wembley hotel booking for you lot and now the break-up or is it a mass desertion. Look I personally luv watching Wenger’s style of football put out there but it ain’t my team, so between the sulks what has gone wrong and as a fan what would you like to see this coming 2008-2009 season?

Dave: I had a feeling you would go there Cass! How? Not sure. It was a season of payback to our Gunners team. From our local rivals giving us a serious beating, (I sent Leo a congrats text, enjoy it while you can! He did), and so many draws when the points lost were crucial, the usual injuries, and lack of maturity, Arsne is a see’er and he sees next season for his young guns to come out blasting. Our small consolation is making a little history beating AC Milan. Mass desertion? As the great ‘Pele’ said, ‘The players kiss the shirt they wear until more money is offered then they kiss the next shirt!’ Who beat's! Don’t you love it next time around? Let it be known I sneaked around the Cass set with my colours underneath my jacket, just in case I had to stir up a little extra energy! Thank God it was not needed. It may have backfired on me. The Arsenal team I feel utilised last season as a great learning since Henry left, the players stepped up and played more of a team instead of feeding Henry the ball and that was a huge change in them all.

Copyright © Cass Pennant 2007 - 2008